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Posted: 30 November 2012 14:03:13(UTC)

Joined: 30/11/2012(UTC)
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New member from flooded Devon.

A friend of mine has been assisting me and others to compare service offerings between Quilter and St James Place Wealth Man't (SJP).

I recognise the two firms offer different means of actively managing investment funds/ portfolios. There seems to be endless comment in the forum on SJP ( some positive, some negative) , but there is little comment on Quilter. I have met with both and I feel more comfortable with Quilter , and there charges are approx 1% lower per annum than SJP...assuming I were to deal with Quilter directly , ie with no IFA. The most concerning issue surrounding SJP is the 5% bid/offer spread they apply which appears to masquerade as a hefty initial charge, and a charge which would really detract from weighted portfolio returns if funds are switched on a regular basis..(.eg if markets become volatile etc).

Other than Quilter and SJP can any members recommend other discretionary fund managers.In particular i would be intrigued to hear whether any untied active fund managers are willing to only receive a fee ( albeit an enhanced fee/ AMC) if they outperform the benchmark for a particular thus establishing a win/win relationship.

Any feedback welcomed as i have £500K + to invest.
Posted: 30 November 2012 16:42:24(UTC)

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SJP have an awful reputation, whether it is deserved or not, no idea.

You might want to check out Signature. Small operation, but speak a lot of sense. (and no, I do not work for them or have any dealings with them, just come onto my radar recently, and quite liked what I saw).
David Tonchin
Posted: 30 November 2012 18:44:46(UTC)

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I would suggest BestInvest
Posted: 30 November 2012 20:29:13(UTC)

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Currently in a similar position myself and looking at Brooks MacDonald and Investec Asset Mgm, would be grateful for any feedback on either of these too.
Posted: 30 November 2012 20:54:12(UTC)

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Heard nothing but praise for Brooks. They might have lost some of their "family" feel as they have grown, but other than that, seem a decent mob. IMO, there is usually little to choose between DFMs, it is more about how YOU feel when dealing with them.
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Tricky on 30/11/2012(UTC), simon bradley on 05/12/2012(UTC)
Posted: 30 November 2012 21:30:38(UTC)

Joined: 30/11/2012(UTC)
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Thx for responses to date ; has anybody dealt with Quilter ?
graham P
Posted: 30 November 2012 21:49:05(UTC)

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I have just left a major bank private banking after 6 years of moderate performance and would offer the following advice.
Do not pay initial charge on any funds .
Do not agree to pay an exit fee .
Do not pay trail commissions.
Do not use high street banks who recommend their own funds.
Look at Fidelity, Best Invest ETC
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banjofred on 01/12/2012(UTC)
Steve L.
Posted: 01 December 2012 10:11:18(UTC)

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No experience with Quilter, but I do use Bestinvest Advisory service and found it to be good value with competitive charges. They also offer DFM so that might be worth exploring.

Defacto provide a rating on DFM, Quilter are rated 5*
Posted: 01 December 2012 10:53:04(UTC)

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John, what sort of charges are they asking for? I have been quoted (informally at this stage) between .75% and 1% management fee as a direct client without an IFA and a recharge of institutional rather than retail investment fees, which I am given to understand are about half and obviously vary depending on the type of investment. As has already been said no extra initial charges or exit fees should be paid, some will force you to go through and also pay an extra commission for an IFA, which in my experience is a total waste of money. Thanks for the Defaqto link, showing my current provider near the bottom, I had already worked that one out for myself after a disappointing year, hence the change!
Posted: 01 December 2012 17:25:55(UTC)

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AS HL say when they want to be indirect.

I have a number of placed I would invest money. SJP IS NOT ONE OF THEM.

Just Google ......... plenty on there

graham P
Posted: 01 December 2012 20:20:00(UTC)

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Having previously replied to the above topic can you believe, today I have received a correction to the cancelation of my private banking portfolio. I asked for all my ISA and PEP funds to be transferred to new managers which has been done and the balance paid to my current account.(£953.45).
In the last five years I have paid in excess of £20,000.00 for Initial charges and AMC.
The bank have now written to informed me that SIX PENCE will be withdrawn from my current account as I have been overpaid.
High Street banks are not fund managers plenty of advice about why not split your portfolio and have a go yourself then if things go wrong you can only blame yourself.
Andrew Barwick
Posted: 02 December 2012 10:19:49(UTC)

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I have split my investments and put a chunk into (sort of) passive funds where the running costs will be be very low, so at least I won't be funding too many "golden handshakes" from that segment. If you want to consider this I suggest looking at the Vanguard LifeStrategy funds which seem like a good way of having someone look after my asset allocation at low cost and I've invested in them. See here:
Posted: 02 December 2012 11:28:46(UTC)

Joined: 23/09/2012(UTC)
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Not in finance industry but have just completed in 2012 a move to Discretioanry Management service. Previously was with BestInvest advisory service 600k+ funds ISAs and non ISAs and 500k SIPPs with Hargreaves Landsdown. Decided to consolidate due to family reasons to help family manage finances as my future is more uncertain. Decided to directly approach DMS and found it hard to choose but eventually short listed 4 , sent them my own detailed questionnaire with backgound of my circumstances as to how they worked and had varying replies in detail and interest of response. Also looked at what IFAs were choosing under RDR rules and their reasons.

Eventually selected Seven Investment. Reasons their investment strategy is very "middle or road" and seem regarded as safe hands if not cutting edge. I had impression I could leave them to get on with it and my wife liked very much the interaction and approach for dealing with clients (she is on steep learning curve). They contribute to ARC and are happy to share that with clients. Investment decision are made as whole for everybody not at a a manager level. Their costs were reasonable especially as investments became greater that £1m and also their was option to choose easil mixture of active and passive approaches. Quilter and Brooke were two companies knowing what I know now I would have put on short list but at time didn't t make it, although 7IM would still have been in the mix as their style (middle of road), stand investment approach not advisor dependant and their rxcellent client interaction, cost effective transparent charges met my needs. Downsides their IT Portal is behind others at least for direct clients.
Norman Englender
Posted: 02 December 2012 11:31:08(UTC)

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I have no experience of either SJP or Quilter, although I have met both.

Anyone any views on Ruffer?
David Chapman
Posted: 02 December 2012 11:35:35(UTC)

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I have experience of SJP - High charges - ongoing fees - early exit fees - trail fees - the list goes on and on - AVOID
I use Chartwell/Cofunds and do my own research and investing - I do not pay initial fees and trail fees are part rebated - a good deal
If you feel confident enough then I feel that is the way to go !
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Norman Englender on 02/12/2012(UTC)
david rogers
Posted: 02 December 2012 12:47:15(UTC)

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I talked to Ruffer and liked them but found their proposal very much along the lines of an investment in the Ruffer IT which I hold in any case.
If you are seeking an Ifa which will go deeply into your personal circumstances, likely timing of cash flow needs and regular adjustment if necessary I suggest and recommend Fowler Drew (formerly No Monkey Business)
Posted: 02 December 2012 19:23:06(UTC)

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A few investors have suggested diy. I decided to do just that about 10 years ago. I ditched all my existing funds during the dot com crash era feeling that i was supporting investment managers bonuses and getting nothing in return.
Instead I started a policy of investing only in Investment Trusts as opposed to funds. Though not as numerous as funds there are still many hundreds of trusts to choose from. According to most reports Trusts generally outperform funds anyway in terms of capital performance and low ownership cost. My own experience along the way also substantiates this claim.
Next, I needed a low cost execution only broker. I have been through a few but I ultimately chose to consolidate most of my investments to Sippdeal who offer Isa, sipp or plain vanilla investing accounts.
More Sippdeal are a rare breed who do not charge annual management fees for holding share type investments and charge only a simple £10 trading fee . I also use my own banks trading desk directly for some investments as it too only imposes a simple trading fee in this case £11 and no other charges.
In terms of investments I started off cautiously with a few generalist trusts but as experience increased I included individual company shares, etfs as well as expanding the range of trusts I invest in. Note, still no annual charges of any sort.
Yes, some investment mistakes along the way but just like the professionals I generally have just a few percent in each equity in an attempt to be more diverse and less prone to individual accidents.
Now in retirement I have moved to about half in cash type investments and half in equity/trust based investments as this ratio helps my sleep. Despite this I am substantially ahead of pre-credit crunch figures.
And where do I get my investment advice? The internet, common sense and a well rehearsed sanity check before every push of the BUY button.

Posted: 03 December 2012 10:06:06(UTC)

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No mention of Fisher Wealth who have been trying to seduce me for c. three years...
Seems to me that charges are irrelevant IF the performance is good..
Does anyone know of a WM company that only charges in line with performance ?
Andrew Duthie
Posted: 06 December 2012 10:36:50(UTC)

Joined: 06/12/2012(UTC)
Posts: 1

Defaqto are also holding a conference on DFMs in 2013, link below. Engage contains data on DFMs, that may be of use.
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