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PETITION Pay Day Loan capping
Prof Eman
Posted: 30 November 2012 13:33:44(UTC)
#1

Joined: 08/04/2010(UTC)
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The House of Lords has set the ball rolling on restricting the interest rate charged on pay day loans.
If you feel it does need some control, please sign the petition as indicated below-

UPDATE: A leap forward on payday loans
Inbox
x
Arthur Breens via Change.org mail@change.org

Change.org

Huge progress on payday lenders -- THANK YOU!

Yesterday the House of Lords forced the Government to rewrite a part of the Financial Services Bill to allow restrictions to be imposed on the interest rates charged for payday loans.

I wrote to you earlier this week asking you to give some last minute support to urge the Lords to back an interest cap on these loans after my foster daughter got caught in an unrelenting cycle of debt. More than 50,000 of you signed in just four days -- I am amazed at the response.

We even got some media coverage in The Guardian
, Mail.co.uk
, The Independent
and The Huffington Post
.

The campaign on payday lending has been going on since 2010, and I've been working with Community Organisers at Movement for Change organising actions around the country to highlight the need for change. You can follow their "Shark Stoppers" campaign here

and follow them on Twitter here
.

It's not quite over yet -- the House of Commons will look at the amended legislation next week then it goes back to the House of Lords. We are confident, though, that the Government will be forced to cap the cost of credit.

Please continue to share this petition with your friends and family on Facebook
, Twitter
or by email to keep the pressure on both the House of Lords and the House of Commons until the interest cap becomes law: www.change.org/arthurs-petition

This campaign has been driven by some amazing people. By signing this petition you became one of them. I thank you very much for doing so.

Arthur

.

sgjhaghsdg
Posted: 30 November 2012 14:53:15(UTC)
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Not one I'll be signing as I think grown adults should be free to make their own financial decisions.
3 users thanked sgjhaghsdg for this post.
Chris G on 30/11/2012(UTC), Clive B on 30/11/2012(UTC), Jeremy Bosk on 06/12/2012(UTC)
Prof Eman
Posted: 30 November 2012 15:24:32(UTC)
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sgjhaghsdg
Including vulnerable people?
Perhaps we should abolish all laws and regulations, as most of us are grown up adults and can make our own decisions as to what is good or bad etc??
sgjhaghsdg
Posted: 30 November 2012 15:44:17(UTC)
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No, not all laws and regulations, but a good half of them, and stop bringing in stupid new ones.
1 user thanked sgjhaghsdg for this post.
Chris G on 30/11/2012(UTC)
Clive B
Posted: 30 November 2012 17:09:57(UTC)
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I can't support things like this. Comes from the same school of thought that says we should ban fast food or sugary drinks because some people over indulge massively.
mark jukes
Posted: 01 December 2012 18:31:38(UTC)
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Joined: 06/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 4

Everybody body knows vunerable people - These are the people that we say are "not very good with money" - great in any other aspect of life, just crap when it comes to money.
Just the kind of people these vultures trap into a spiral of debt.
Its really no better than loan sharking so lets not just cap the interest, lets make the whole business illegal.
Banks and Credit card companies threw money at people without proper checks before the last financial crash and here we have other companies doing the same - creating a bubble of credit around people who may not be able to pay their debts.
Sorry, just not the same as banning burgers
Clive B
Posted: 01 December 2012 19:02:09(UTC)
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@ mark jukes

Fine, if you want to ban such firms, go ahead - but I doubt very much you'll have solved anything, the problem will just go "underground". Desparate people will simply become entangled with real loan sharks, the type who use physical violence rather than the courts to get their money back.

One only has to think of prostitution or the drug trade where society says to itself "I've banned it, problem solved"....only to find they've made the problem MUCH worse, as victims have no recourse to the law as they have to admit to doing something unlawful and get themselves nicked for their troubles.
2 users thanked Clive B for this post.
sgjhaghsdg on 01/12/2012(UTC), Jeremy Bosk on 06/12/2012(UTC)
sgjhaghsdg
Posted: 01 December 2012 19:13:17(UTC)
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We're not talking about kids but grown adults of over 18, and money is just numbers and can easily be mastered by such people if they made a little effort.

If you cap interest rates then you basically cap risk, so no-one without a whiter than white credit record will be allowed to borrow money, no matter how short term their need.

There was a letter in a weekend paper today from someone who had to get a human to authorise their purchase of a chocolate pudding as the supermarket self-scan checkout wouldn't let them buy it. It seems that it needs to be heated, and hot things can burn people...

Sheesh!

1 user thanked sgjhaghsdg for this post.
Clive B on 01/12/2012(UTC)
mark jukes
Posted: 01 December 2012 20:58:27(UTC)
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Joined: 06/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 4

Pay day lenders do not save people from illegal loan sharks. Pay day lenders would not lend to the kind of people who can only get credit through loan sharks. The pay day lenders created the business they are in - introducing it to people who would not normally use this kind of service. If it was banned it would'nt go underground it would just disappear. They are not supplying a service to desparate people but in the process they are making some vunerable people desparate.
Linking this to prostitution and the drugs trade says it all.
Some aparently "normal" people struggle with numerousy (just as I seem to be struggling with my spelling!) and they cannot do money or numbers full stop.
1 in 5 people in this country cannot read or write particularly well or even at all.
I guess all these people should make more effort!
mark jukes
Posted: 01 December 2012 21:03:01(UTC)
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Joined: 06/01/2012(UTC)
Posts: 4

p.s.
Dont believe everything you read in the papers!
sgjhaghsdg
Posted: 02 December 2012 08:44:51(UTC)
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> I guess all these people should make more effort!

That would certainly be a very good start.
Prof Eman
Posted: 02 December 2012 13:11:01(UTC)
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Banks and financial services need regulation.
Can anyone tell me why pay day lenders do not need to be regulated?
sgjhaghsdg
Posted: 02 December 2012 16:28:02(UTC)
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I'm afraid that argument is a straw man.

All lending in the UK is under licence from the Office of Fair Trading and is governed by the Consumer Credit Act of 1974.

All advertising of this lending is regulated by the Advertising Standard Agency.

As it happens, I make interest free pay advances to my employees but only one per year so that it's used for real emergencies rather than just extra beer money.
2 users thanked sgjhaghsdg for this post.
Clive B on 02/12/2012(UTC), Jeremy Bosk on 06/12/2012(UTC)
Prof Eman
Posted: 02 December 2012 23:42:52(UTC)
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sgj...
All lending is subject to OFT, Consumer Credit Act, Advertising Standards Agency.
And so is/has been all the bank and other lending that has brought on the recession. I do not see that this safeguards anything.
As regards your interest free loans to your employees, nice to know you are a kind and understanding employer, but I do not know of many like you. Then again it does make sense, better than leaving them open to the vultures in the pay day loan industry.
jeffian
Posted: 03 December 2012 00:01:32(UTC)
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Prof,
The people you are most worried about are at the bottom end of the scale and pretty desperate. If you ban pay-day loans or cap the interest rate (ahem! look at some of the penalties mainstream banks and building societies charge for unauthorised overdrafts!) then you simply drive them into the arms of the real backstreet merchants. The problem is on the demand, not the supply, side!
Prof Eman
Posted: 03 December 2012 00:35:56(UTC)
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jeffian
It is not an idle concern.
Whether through pay day loans or loan sharks, these people are driven to desperation and sooner rather than later, they usually end up on benefits, or worse still, end up homeless.
The issue then becomes ever increasing expenditure on benefits, and unpleasantness like calling them scroungers, particularly when they become long term unemployed.
This is the real effect of supply and demand that we should be considering, and how to stop the escalation of benefit expenditure.
sgjhaghsdg
Posted: 03 December 2012 08:03:14(UTC)
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Given that lending is already heavily regulated, I don't see knee-jerk reactions such as more regulation as being even close to a solution. Neither do I see rebranding benefits scroungers as "long-term unemployed" or "employment impaired" as being one either!

Our benefits system is clearly broken, and we seem to have grown adults who don't understand how compound interest works, which doesn't exactly cover our educational system in glory.
Prof Eman
Posted: 03 December 2012 15:48:14(UTC)
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They say prevention is better than the cure?
Would capping interest rates help with prevention?
sgjhaghsdg
Posted: 03 December 2012 16:38:08(UTC)
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No, probably not.

What we're seeing is thinking along these lines.
1) We must do something.
2) This is something.
3) Therefore we must do this.
Prof Eman
Posted: 03 December 2012 17:57:16(UTC)
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shj....
Not quite sure where you got your 3 points from.
However responding to them-
1) We must to something. Not a bad idea if it helps to control benefit spending.
2) This is something. Indeed it is, but no-one said it was the only thing.
3) Therefore we must do it. No-one is compelling any-one to do it . But under our democracy people are allowed to express their opinion via a petition.
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