Share this page:
Stay connected:
Welcome to the Citywire Money Forums, where members share investment ideas and discuss everything to do with their money.

You'll need to log in or set up an account to start new discussions or reply to existing ones. See you inside!

Notification

Icon
Error
Are private toll roads the answer to Britain’s congestion problem?
+ Reply to discussion
Options
Victoria Bischoff (Citywire)
Posted: 31 August 2010 08:55:30(UTC)
#1

Joined: 08/03/2010(UTC)
Posts: 96

Was thanked: 5 time(s) in 2 post(s)
Private toll roads are not a solution to congestion on British roads, a new report has warned the government today.

The only example of a private toll road in the UK, the M6 Toll in the West Midlands, has been a colossal and expensive failure, according to environmental group Campaign for Better Transport.*

The report claims the M6 Toll has failed to provide the congestion relief promised when it opened in December 2003, with traffic on the M6 still at pre-toll levels and journeys only marginally quicker as a result of above-average increases in traffic.

In fact the M6 Toll has done so little to improve congestion on the M6 that the government has been forced to consider other transport initiatives to help ease congestion - such as allowing cars to use the hard shoulder during the rush hour, a scheme which would cost between £300 and £500 million to implement.

Many motorists have also been put off by the cost of the toll, which has more than doubled from £2 per car when it opened to £5 today.

The report also estimates the private company that runs the toll road, Midland Expressway Ltd, has lost around £26 million each year since it opened, which is discouraging to potential investors.

But what do you think?

With public finances under pressure, are privately financed and operated toll roads a solution to congestion on Britain’s motorways? And if not how else can the government improve our roads?

Would you be happy to pay a toll if it meant a slightly shorter journey? Or are toll roads a waste of money for already cash-strapped motorists?

* http://www.bettertranspo...-Toll-Report-Aug-10.pdf
Back to top Quote
Anonymous Post
Posted: 31 August 2010 09:42:44(UTC)
#2
Anonymous 1 needed this 'Off the Record'

The M6 toll road is brilliant - I just wish it was longer!!
No more sitting in rows of cars and lorries belching out exhaust fumes. The service station is better as well!!
The only drawback is joining the M6 going north.....
Back to top Quote
Alan Tonks
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:08:35(UTC)
#3

Joined: 09/08/2010(UTC)
Posts: 11
Why on earth should motorists pay for roads, that they are already paying billions of pounds a year for?

The roads we do travel on cost us even more with the damage to our cars, which exceeds a lunar landscape.
Back to top Quote
justb
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:09:40(UTC)
#4

Joined: 10/06/2010(UTC)
Posts: 1
I agree it is excellent.

However, if we want to make it work for everyday travellers it needs to be cheaper. £50 a week for commuter is too expensive and 5% discount for using their tag system is not sufficient.

Why is it we can't understand that if you make something cheaper more people will use it and therefore you will make the same or even more profit. It works for primark.
Back to top Quote
A Donald
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:09:51(UTC)
#5

Joined: 21/06/2010(UTC)
Posts: 2
The only drawback to the M6 Toll is joining it from the South.

Unless you are familiar with the signposting, you will end up on the 'old M6' instead of the toll road.

Otherwise it is brilliant - but i could not afford to travel the whole 560mls at those prices!!
Back to top Quote
Evan Owen
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:16:39(UTC)
#6

Joined: 05/04/2008(UTC)
Posts: 9
The cost of the M6 Toll is horrendous and getting to it from the M54 is a nightmare. British motorists pay through the nose in fuel duty, car tax, VAT, and anything else the government can milk them with and we still have roads that the rest of the EU would not tolerate!!
Back to top Quote
Mike Greenland
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:18:28(UTC)
#7

Joined: 10/06/2010(UTC)
Posts: 4
If motoring taxes were reduced to match the level of expenditure then paying for toll roads would be fine. Not when we already pay for roads 5 times over though.
Back to top Quote
Ivor Nestegg
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:26:09(UTC)
#8

Joined: 16/07/2009(UTC)
Posts: 38
The M6 toll is indeed excellent but it only bypasses Birmingham itself. One still has the same horrible grind from there up to past Preston before the M6 becomes what a motroway should be again.

Disagree about access fro the south - I find you are more likely to end up on the Toll Road when you don't want to be than vice versa.

Then there is the question of pricing and the collection - no one is going to pay £5 to use the Toll Road when the other one is free unless the congestion is bad enough to make the saving in time worth paying for. A more flexible system of tariffs with discounts for frequent users is needed.

And, so far as collection is concerned, look at Italy and France with automated toll gates, which accept credit and debit cards and "Telepass" facilities for regular users. The Italian machines even manage to say "arrivederce" to you as you drive off.

Then compare. the U.K. which, typically, sticks with passing money and change back and forth through a window to a sour faced old guy in a box. Hardly designed to encourage people to use the facility!
Back to top Quote
Dave in London
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:28:28(UTC)
#9

Joined: 09/03/2009(UTC)
Posts: 2
M6 toll is great, foot down, 140mph, no traffic, I'd pay a tenner for it
Back to top Quote
MC
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:30:10(UTC)
#10

Joined: 25/01/2008(UTC)
Posts: 5
Glad to hear Midland Expressway Ltd is losing money as the whole point of the 'toll road' was to alleviate congestion on the old M6, which it categorically has failed to do.

I do not understand why they built a 6 lane motorway and then bumped up prices to a level where there is barely two lanes being used. Typical government incompetence. The only commercial way to fix the situation is to drop fees to £1.50 each way. If the toll road become too busy it is only at that stage that you increase them.

However, to really solve congestion the M6 toll should rejoin the old free motorway network and be used purely for NW-SE travel leaving the old M6 to connect to Birmingham and the M5.

The sad thing is none of this is complicated but will this or any other government ever sort it out? Don't hold your breath





Back to top Quote
Gerald Cadogan
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:31:56(UTC)
#11

Joined: 10/06/2010(UTC)
Posts: 12

Was thanked: 1 time(s) in 1 post(s)
Paying tolls to use roads is an absolutely rediculous, hairbrained idea - typical of politicians who fail to understand why they were elected. Lets get rid of this stupid idea once and for all - we all pay through the nose for roads and a decent transport infrastructure through all the existing (way too high) motor taxation. Toll roads are a bad idea period! The politicians need to realise that we expect them to address congestion problems by providing better and if necessary more roads, not through odd-ball toll roads, congestion charging, speed fines, speed limits and any of the other panolpy of crazy ideas - they just need to get real and spend the money on where its really needed, not pet, politically correct, self serving projects.
Back to top Quote
vikki
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:32:57(UTC)
#12

Joined: 24/02/2009(UTC)
Posts: 3
The M6 toll road is brilliant - I just wish it was longer agree with Anoymous 1


Worth every penny just to get away from all the heavy goods wagons, but on driving south you still meet up, where the toll road ends with the M6 congestion.

If only they would extend it further South this road would be a real success and big money earner,.

Just look at the time saving involved, don't think companies are taking into account true employment costs when they refuse to let their employee's claim back the toll fee's for company Vehicle use.

Also I cost in the safety aspect of using this road, together with arriving at your destination must fresher, less tired, ready to start the day.

So yes please lets have more toll roads, for you then have the choice either to pay for the convenience and speed of the toll road, or use the normal motorway.
Back to top Quote
mikeran
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:41:09(UTC)
#13

Joined: 25/06/2010(UTC)
Posts: 8
The Uk solution is perhaps different to many parts of Europe. I regularly travel from SW France to the Channel Ports and return, to and from the UK. I use the Motorway system within France and a sinlgle one way journey will cost me some 45 euros in tolls. Which in my case are automatically collected from my windscreen badge. But the road quality is very good, and I can on stretches leave my cruise control in non stop for some 100 miles. Also on Sundays most lorries are prohibited to travel. But France has space outside of its main hubs, seems to have an energetic road management and building system. And a lot of new roads seem to be in Part funded by the EU.

But when I cross the Channel back to the M25 or M11 I am gridlocked.
As for road funding in France you do not pay road Tax as a separate fee, quite how it is all funded, I am not sure. Diesel is cheaper than the UK, petrol about the same or slightly less. Insurance in many cases is higer than the UK.
Back to top Quote
Anonymous Post
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:44:30(UTC)
#14
Anonymous 2 needed this 'Off the Record'

The problem with the M6 north of Birmingham is quite a simple one, you can't squeeze four motorways (M56 West, M56 East, M62 West and M62 East) worth of traffic on to one motorway of the same size. It just can't be done and it must have been obvious decades ago. Given the volume of traffic that flows into the M6 it should be twice the size and then maybe it might be able to cope without breaking down four times a day.
Back to top Quote
John Sorrie
Posted: 31 August 2010 10:50:25(UTC)
#15

Joined: 23/05/2008(UTC)
Posts: 1
Well Toll Roads seem to work in Canada. Regular users have a gadget in their car that records when they enter and leave the motorway. Other users have their license plate recorded by camera and receive a bill in the post for the number of miles driven. So no drawbacks of having to go through a toll gate and handover cash. The Canadians only gripe is that the main toll road is now owned by the Chinese or some other foreing concern!

I do agree with many that at £5 the M6 toll is too expensive.
Back to top Quote
Patrick Colquhoun
Posted: 31 August 2010 11:25:17(UTC)
#16

Joined: 31/08/2010(UTC)
Posts: 1
It seems to me that the company would save a lot of money by making the road free. A win-win situation for motorists, the M6 and the company. Let common sense prevail from now. If they charge more, fewer would use it, M6 congestion will grow and the company will make an even bigger loss.
Back to top Quote
Jon Gallagher
Posted: 31 August 2010 12:45:18(UTC)
#17

Joined: 01/08/2010(UTC)
Posts: 91
The main problem with the UK being congested is a simple one - we are too overpopulated and with the population expected to increae to 77 million in 2050 then the whole country will be in stalemate as can we cope with another 17 million cars on the road because lets face it, everyone wants a car. This population explosion also does little for the governments green agenda with millions more exhaust fumes. I am so glad i live up in Scotland as it must be horrendous in the south and south east and the m^ is a nightmare Takes me 15 minutes to get to work am pleased to say and no, i would not pay a toll to use a road. We have just got rid of the tolls on all bridges up here and we dont want to see them return.
Back to top Quote
Alan Hill
Posted: 31 August 2010 13:21:31(UTC)
#18

Joined: 27/07/2006(UTC)
Posts: 1
Better transport systems will follow automatically if the government actually spent the road taxation income, including fuel taxex, on the transport systems we need. NO PROBLEM! IT'S ONLY MONEY AND IT'S KEPT IN THE TREASURY!

Back to top Quote
Colin Gregg
Posted: 31 August 2010 15:38:40(UTC)
#19

Joined: 31/08/2010(UTC)
Posts: 7
I think the M6 Toll should be made into the "proper" M6 (free) and make the existing M6 the Toll Road.
This would wonders for relieving the through-traffic on the existing M'way....

...and for those who have to go there anyway, Birmingham is such a wondrous, wonderful place, people should pay to visit it!


Tongue FIRMLY in cheek
Back to top Quote
derek farman
Posted: 31 August 2010 16:21:10(UTC)
#20

Joined: 01/05/2009(UTC)
Posts: 43

Was thanked: 2 time(s) in 2 post(s)
Campaign for better transport !!!! If they think the road is a colossal failure , then why do I and so many other road users love it ?

We pay up every time to avoid the M6 , so surely this means that toll roads are a good idea . The idea of using the hard shoulder of the M6 during rush hour is a daft idea . It would be better to have a reduced tariff of say £2 during the rush hour on the toll .
Back to top Quote
2 Pages12Next page
+ Reply to discussion

Markets

Other markets